uTorrent V1.7 - ***Warning***

[quote029b711e03]Los Angeles - - BitTorrent Founder and CEO Bram Cohen and Motion Picture Association of America, Inc. (MPAA) Chairman and CEO Dan Glickman announced today that the motion picture industry and BitTorrent, Inc. are collaborating with the goal of inhibiting film piracy. Bram Cohen developed a revolutionary technology for websites to make large content files available on the Web and that technology is often used by others illegally to distribute movies and television shows. Today Cohen confirmed BitTorrent, Inc.’s commitment to removing links that direct users to copies of pirated content owned by MPAA companies from its search engine at BitTorrent.com. The announcement today is historic in that two major forces in the technology and film industries have agreed to work together and proactively identify ways to l and to promote constructive innovation in this area.

This is Bram Cohen, the creator of the BitTorrent protocol, and Ludvig (Ludde) Strigeus, the writer of µTorrent.

Together, we are pleased to announce that BitTorrent, Inc. and µTorrent AB have decided to join forces. BitTorrent has acquired µTorrent as it recognized the merits of µTorrent's exceptionally well-written codebase and robust user community. Bringing together µTorrent's efficient implementation and compelling UI with BitTorrent's expertise in networking protocols will significantly benefit the community with what we envision will be the best BitTorrent client.[/quote029b711e03]

Cliffs BitTorrent, basically owned by MPAA, joined with uTorrent. V1.7 was released [b029b711e03]after[/b029b711e03] this agreement. Basically, MPAA released uTorrent V1.7. They might have added a few "features" that would make it easier to catch people who illegally pirate copyrighted material.

Hrmm... I use Utorrent 1.7.1 for a few things here and there...guess I should stop.

Azureus FTW

[quote25da764fae="tylerc"]Azureus FTW[/quote25da764fae]
^^^

Not that I download movies so it's not an issue for me anyway, but now I get to gloat over all those folks who've nagged me about using Azureus, and complain that I should use uTorrent. I've used uTorrent and have always said Azureus eats it's lunch. lol

Azureus is a bit of a RAM hog, but whatevs, I use Mac so that's the only halfway decent option.

What's the source for this?

most private torrent sites have banned 1.7

am i ok using 1.6?

i might have to go back to azaureus with its ram hogging abilities.

And I still say the "RAM hog" reputation is bogus, and not understood by most. Most people who say that are just parroting what they've heard others say, but have no idea of the real issue nor have ever experienced a problem due to "RAM hogging."

First, with any modern PC with 1GB or more of RAM, you [b89f5864cb2]won't miss[/b89f5864cb2] the RAM that Azureus uses.

Secondly, it doesn't use that much compared to a lot of other apps. Say... Firefox anybody? Right now as I type this, Firefox reports a Working set of 94MB and Peak Working Set of 119MB. Azureus, which has been running for awhile and has 7 seeds going, is reporting a 64MB Working Set, with a Peak of 65MB. Most people who make these claims are looking at Virtual Size, which is meaningless in terms of actual memory usage. Yeah, Azureus looks pretty scary with a 470MB Virtual Size, but that doesn't mean anything. Every 32-bit Windows application gets a 2GB virtual address space, and they can virtually allocate as much as they might want, but they rarely if ever use that much. Many applications intentionally allocate way more than they'll ever use, and in Azureus' case you have a Java VM allocating RAM, and Azureus on top of it allocating RAM, so it looks menacing. However, Working Set and Peak Working Set are the true indicators of how much RAM has been used.

If Azureus or any other program accumulates massive memory allocations over the course of a long runtime, that usually indicates a memory leak bug somewhere. These happen with more programs than you know. With Java applications like Azureus, such memory leaks are usually the fault of a buggy VM and not due to the application itself (since in Java it's pretty difficult to leak memory, compared to C/C++). And that can often be cured by installing an updated JRE.

Thanks for the lesson d
+K

BTW since I posted that, my seed count more than double to 15. Yet Azureus' working set has dropped to 59MB. Seems like pretty efficient memory management to me. ;)

I still use Azureus, although I thought µTorrent had performed better for quite awhile. Now I have no reason to reconsider. ;)

EDIT BTW, I had jumped on that memory bandwagon back in the day. Things have improved, although I still experience some lags, and can't start some program GUI's (Kerio) while it's running. I don't necessarily attribute that to memory usage, though.

Oh, and I forgot to mention that another of Azureus' huge benefits is the fact is IS Java and thus runs on multiple platforms. That and it's large selection of plugins. I run it with the Web Swing plugin on one of my Linux servers, so that no matter where I am, if I find a torrent I want to have finished by the time I get home, I can login to my server, access the Azureus interface in a browser, and kick off the download.

[quoteb9da671025="Tholek"]EDIT BTW, I had jumped on that memory bandwagon back in the day. Things have improved, although I still experience some lags, and can't start some program GUI's (Kerio) while it's running. I don't necessarily attribute that to memory usage, though.[/quoteb9da671025]
The Kerio GUI issue isn't a memory issue. It's a problem with Kerio itself. When you crank it up, it does a process scan of all process with open TCP/IP connections, and enumerates those connections in real-time. It chokes on apps like Azureus, possibly Java-related, that have lots of open connections that change second-by-second. It does eventually open however, you just have to give it a minute to scan all the connections. But again, that's not Azureus' fault, it's Kerio's. To demonstrate, wait for Kerio to finally open, then go the Overview Tab and look at the process list in the Connections tab. Open the Azureus node (it will take forever again, appearing to be locked up). You might have to click a second time and wait. Eventually it will open up with all of Azuerus' connections enumerated, and you'll see the list fluctuating wildly as connections are made and dropped. Kerio just can't handle that type of heavy dynamic activity.

I've been running Az for years, alongside many other apps including major games. Never had a problem.

From BitSoup.org
[quotef11add833f]
There have been reports of utorrent 1.7 sending private info outside the tracker

The client version 1.7 will not be allowed at bitsoup.org because of this problem

we understand the need for a utorrent version to be available to you

please feel free to download utorrent 1.6.1 here http//www.bitsoup.org/pic/UT1.6.1.exe

we are sorry for the troubles our utorrent members have faced due to these bugs[/quotef11add833f]

[quote6e8e03a18f="dmorris68"]BTW since I posted that, my seed count more than double to 15. Yet Azureus' working set has dropped to 59MB. Seems like pretty efficient memory management to me. ;)[/quote6e8e03a18f]

I have an iBook G4 with 512MB RAM.

I'm getting a new Mac Book tomorrow though.

Thanks for the heads up, hadn't paid attention to piracy news for the weekend

So would using Azureus be better than using utorrent 1.6.1? I accidentally updated last week. Should I downgrade or just switch back to Azureus?

[quote52c3b9ecd1="theysayjump"]What's the source for this?[/quote52c3b9ecd1]

http//forum.utorrent.com/viewtopic.php?id=17278

[quotec9e83cee56="Kidd"]most private torrent sites have banned 1.7

am i ok using 1.6?

i might have to go back to azaureus with its ram hogging abilities.[/quotec9e83cee56]

uTorrent 1.6 is fine as far as I know, but private torrent sites might be blocking them for extra [needless] protection.

Old version of uTorrent http//oldversion.com/program.php?n=utorrent

This is a quote from a second hand source, so I don't know its reliability

[quotec9e83cee56]1.7 reports back the torrents you have d/l'ed, your IP, the IP of those that you are d/l or u/l from/to and other identifiable stuff.[/quotec9e83cee56]

If this case is true, if anyone is seeding/leeching using V1.7, then some type of your information is being recorded. Again, I don't know the reliability.

looks like i'll be switching to azeurues.

does this count for music too??

[quote8fc55b09dd="dmorris68"]BTW since I posted that, my seed count more than double to 15. Yet Azureus' working set has dropped to 59MB. Seems like pretty efficient memory management to me. ;)[/quote8fc55b09dd]
Just an update in another vain attempt to put the "RAM hog" rumors to rest I left Az running overnight with about 15 seeds going. This morning I checked it and it was at 70MB working set. Firefox has been running for 10 minutes and is already at 86MB with only 2 tabs open.

So the term "RAM hog" is quite undeserved. Perhaps relative to a tiny C++ executable like uTorrent, it does use more RAM. But it's a non-issue, and compared to many other common apps you run everyday, is nowhere near a hog.

[quotedeb1d5486e="dmorris68"][quotedeb1d5486e="tylerc"]Azureus FTW[/quotedeb1d5486e]
^^^

Not that I download movies so it's not an issue for me anyway, but now I get to gloat over all those folks who've nagged me about using Azureus, and complain that I should use uTorrent. I've used uTorrent and have always said Azureus eats it's lunch. lol[/quotedeb1d5486e]
µTorrent has never worked half as good as Azureus for me. I don't think its a RAM hog at all. Firefox uses more RAM than Azureus for me. I do have 4GB of RAM shrug

There's a pretty simple solution to this guys. Just fire up WPE PRO or any sniffer and see what traffic is coming out of uTorrent. If theres information leaking to an unkown address, you probably can easily tell.

[quote044e216470="W4FWebmaster"]There's a pretty simple solution to this guys. Just fire up WPE PRO or any sniffer and see what traffic is coming out of uTorrent. If theres information leaking to an unkown address, you probably can easily tell.[/quote044e216470]

What? If you're sharing a torrent, anyone has access to it. The MPAA or RIAA aren't tracking you from company/organization headquarters. It's not like you can grab their IP address and figure out who's watching you.

[quote36a03abbe3="dmorris68"][quote36a03abbe3="Tholek"]EDIT BTW, I had jumped on that memory bandwagon back in the day. Things have improved, although I still experience some lags, and can't start some program GUI's (Kerio) while it's running. I don't necessarily attribute that to memory usage, though.[/quote36a03abbe3]
The Kerio GUI issue isn't a memory issue. It's a problem with Kerio itself. When you crank it up, it does a process scan of all process with open TCP/IP connections, and enumerates those connections in real-time. It chokes on apps like Azureus, possibly Java-related, that have lots of open connections that change second-by-second. It does eventually open however, you just have to give it a minute to scan all the connections. But again, that's not Azureus' fault, it's Kerio's. To demonstrate, wait for Kerio to finally open, then go the Overview Tab and look at the process list in the Connections tab. Open the Azureus node (it will take forever again, appearing to be locked up). You might have to click a second time and wait. Eventually it will open up with all of Azuerus' connections enumerated, and you'll see the list fluctuating wildly as connections are made and dropped. Kerio just can't handle that type of heavy dynamic activity.

I've been running Az for years, alongside many other apps including major games. Never had a problem.[/quote36a03abbe3]

What software firewall do you run, (assuming it's not Kerio)?

Not only that, but there's a ton of connections occurring with a bittorrent client. New connections are constantly being made and old ones dropped. Without a specific remote address to filter on, I imagine it would be quite difficult to wade through the mess of a sniffer trace. As we were just discussing earlier in this topic, this is the reason that Azureus kills the Kerio Firewall GUI. The GUI tracks the IP connections to/from each process and attempts to update the GUI in realtime. The sheer volume of dynamic connections essentially overloads and kills the GUI.

[quote3a749e9124="doylnea"][quote3a749e9124="dmorris68"][quote3a749e9124="Tholek"]EDIT BTW, I had jumped on that memory bandwagon back in the day. Things have improved, although I still experience some lags, and can't start some program GUI's (Kerio) while it's running. I don't necessarily attribute that to memory usage, though.[/quote3a749e9124]
The Kerio GUI issue isn't a memory issue. It's a problem with Kerio itself. When you crank it up, it does a process scan of all process with open TCP/IP connections, and enumerates those connections in real-time. It chokes on apps like Azureus, possibly Java-related, that have lots of open connections that change second-by-second. It does eventually open however, you just have to give it a minute to scan all the connections. But again, that's not Azureus' fault, it's Kerio's. To demonstrate, wait for Kerio to finally open, then go the Overview Tab and look at the process list in the Connections tab. Open the Azureus node (it will take forever again, appearing to be locked up). You might have to click a second time and wait. Eventually it will open up with all of Azuerus' connections enumerated, and you'll see the list fluctuating wildly as connections are made and dropped. Kerio just can't handle that type of heavy dynamic activity.

I've been running Az for years, alongside many other apps including major games. Never had a problem.[/quote3a749e9124]

What software firewall do you run, (assuming it's not Kerio)?[/quote3a749e9124]
I do run Kerio, that's why I'm familiar with the issue. ;)

To clarify, the Kerio firewall itself doesn't have a problem working with Azureus or anything else. The problem Tholek and I were discussing is simply the Kerio GUI that gives real-time feedback on what processes are doing, including their connections.

[quote06aa41417f="doylnea"][quote06aa41417f="W4FWebmaster"]There's a pretty simple solution to this guys. Just fire up WPE PRO or any sniffer and see what traffic is coming out of uTorrent. If theres information leaking to an unkown address, you probably can easily tell.[/quote06aa41417f]

What? If you're sharing a torrent, anyone has access to it. The MPAA or RIAA aren't tracking you from company/organization headquarters. It's not like you can grab their IP address and figure out who's watching you.[/quote06aa41417f]

Yeah, but you can see what kind of data is being sent to whatever ip. There's quite some commotion about this going on with uTorrent 1.7+. I'm not talking about IPAddy's. And if a tracker really wanted to test this, it wouldn't be too tough to compare the ip's logged from a trackers members database and those found while sniffing.

Would Peer Guardian catch that? I'm not going back, but I wonder if that's a fix for those who want to stick with uTorrent.

[quote5d257e8b2a="dmorris68"][quote5d257e8b2a="doylnea"]What software firewall do you run, (assuming it's not Kerio)?[/quote5d257e8b2a]
I do run Kerio, that's why I'm familiar with the issue. ;)

To clarify, the Kerio firewall itself doesn't have a problem working with Azureus or anything else. The problem Tholek and I were discussing is simply the Kerio GUI that gives real-time feedback on what processes are doing, including their connections.[/quote5d257e8b2a]

Gotcha, I've used Kerio for while and been happy with it - just always looking for something better.

[quote6a5dea15d7="Tholek"]Would Peer Guardian catch that? I'm not going back, but I wonder if that's a fix for those who want to stick with uTorrent.[/quote6a5dea15d7]

No, because PG relies on public DB's of IPs that are often many days if not weeks out of date.

[quote752fb5e195="Tholek"]Would Peer Guardian catch that? I'm not going back, but I wonder if that's a fix for those who want to stick with uTorrent.[/quote752fb5e195]

most likely not at first. PG's database consists of blacklisted ip ranges, like governments/military, and large corporations etc. They might have some of MPAA's known addresses, but if uTorrent is now affiliated with MPAA, they can easily setup some outside, unknown server to collect information.

If it is going on, I'm sure it will be caught soon. I presume this is something NOT easily hidden since all traffic can be analyzed if someone/group takes the time.

... or what Doylnea just said ... beat me to it

[quote0672d6ac44="doylnea"][quote0672d6ac44="Tholek"]Would Peer Guardian catch that? I'm not going back, but I wonder if that's a fix for those who want to stick with uTorrent.[/quote0672d6ac44]

No, because PG relies on public DB's of IPs that are often many days if not weeks out of date.[/quote0672d6ac44]

Well, that goes without saying. It's the main criticism of PG in general. ;)

What I mean, is will the IP addresses contacted by UT be ones that can be blocked from outside the app with something like PG, or would the same IPs used for checking for updates be the ones receiving the torrent info data?

I'm wondering how masked or embedded that communication is.

[quote7d0ba5d4c4="W4FWebmaster"]... or what Doylnea just said ... beat me to it[/quote7d0ba5d4c4]

I know how you feel. ;)

what happened to azureus? "vuze"?

it used to just be what is now "view -> advanced." it's dumbed down and has a bunch of videos I don't want to watch (.

UH OHHH, TROUBLE IN THE HOUSE. I BETTER STOP! ;)

...posting?

[quoteebca49a621="zdub08"]what happened to azureus? "vuze"?

it used to just be what is now "view -> advanced." it's dumbed down and has a bunch of videos I don't want to watch (.[/quoteebca49a621]
Yeah, Azureus 3.0/Vuze has been out awhile, it's basically aimed at being a "legal" media sharing sellout. However 2.5 is still available -- look just below the Vuze header on the front page. Or just go to the Sourceforge project site directly.